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Julie Duffy Dillon (00:00)

Welcome to episode 408 of the Find Your Food Voice podcast. Today, my team and I are talking about how you, VoiceFinder, can continue to fight diets even in 2025. Let’s get to it.

Julie Duffy Dillon (00:13)

your food voice to identify what’s disconnecting you from knowing how to eat and stop dieting forever. Grab the book wherever books are sold or at julieduffydillon.com.

Julie Duffy Dillon (00:25)

Hey there, Julie Duffy Dillon here, registered dietician and your host of the Find Your Food Voice podcast. Today’s episode is jam packed because it is a chat episode where Coleen Bremner, Rachel Popik and I discuss a topic and today’s topic is how the hell do we reject diets in the year of 2025, specifically during the chaos and the continued oppression of many different groups just witnessing all of this, trying to hold it all together and also repair and mend your complicated history with food. This also happens to be the day that the Find Your Food Voice book is being born. I’m recording this about two weeks before, so I still am feeling all the nerves and just doing all the things preparing, but Future Julie, I know, is super excited that you finally have your hands on your own copy if you pre-ordered it. If you haven’t ordered it, you can go to a bookstore today and go grab it. I would love if you did, and I can’t wait to hear what you have to say about it. So my team and I picked out specific parts of the book that we hope that you can explore as a way to help to continue to mend even while the world is on fire. And just know we are alongside you, we are with you. And as we are talking about these different tools, we’re gonna bringing up things like ultra processed foods, DEI and how the government in the United States is trying to dismantle all of the wording and progress in diversity, equity, inclusion, and then also stress and stress eating. What are some tools in the Find Your Food Voice book in particular that you can apply if you do have moments of emotional eating or stress eating? So I’m looking forward to sharing this episode after a very quick sponsor break.

Julie Duffy Dillon (02:29)

Hey there everybody!

Rachel (02:31)

Hello! 

Julie Duffy Dillon (02:33)

How’s it going today?

Coleen (02:35)

It’s book launch day!

Rachel (02:36)

really good because it’s book launch day!

Julie Duffy Dillon (02:38)

Yay. And of course, we’re recording this a little early, so I have to just name and be transparent that I’m like, it still doesn’t feel real because it’s not real yet to me, but it’s going to be real to future Julie when this is getting published. I won’t be the only one anymore holding my book. Yes. I’m so excited. Yes. I keep thinking about the analogy of like giving birth and I had a plan C section. It’s getting delivered by UPS driver later today to everyone.

Coleen (02:55)

my gosh, so excited.

Julie Duffy Dillon (03:08)

I am excited that today is the day that you all finally get to read it. And of course, Coleen and Rachel, you both already read it many months ago. I appreciate you doing that. And so today we’re going to talk for just a few seconds about some of our favorite parts, but then also why we need it.

Coleen (03:23)

Yes. It’s just, I just have to name that I am just so excited because getting to be a passenger on this journey and see, you know, some of the ins and outs of your writing and the behind the scenes just feels so very cool. And just, it’s has been such an honor to get to be a part of and witness. So I just want to name that we’re just so excited for you and Rachel, I feel like, yeah, I want you to share too.

Rachel (03:49)

Yes. Yeah. It’s just so cool to when we first met many years ago and started working together, you were still just talking about how it was your dream and your ultimate goal to write a book. And it’s so freaking cool to see that it’s like coming out into the world today. And you went from just a few years ago to that being like this huge dream to really here. Yeah.

Coleen (04:12)

You did it!

Julie Duffy Dillon (04:14)

you can do it too. I mean, that’s the thing. It’s like one of those things, like if I could do it, anyone can. And thank you. Yeah, this has definitely been a dream of mine since I was 12 years old. So it does feel surreal. It hasn’t hit me yet, but I couldn’t have gotten through the last two years of slogging away without the two of you and many other people. But yeah, super grateful for you all. And yes, I’m like nerv-sighted for sure because I’m like nervous about you know, yes. like there’s, you know, you all know, I mean, I have some things in the book that are kind of personal. And so I was like, are gonna read those now. When I wrote them two years ago, you know.

Coleen (04:40)

Vulnerability is such a beautiful thing, Julie, and not everyone can and feels able to do that. So I think that really comes out in your writing and in your voice. And that is an excellent segue actually into, you know, some of our favorite pieces of this book and maybe sharing some of those. So Rachel, do you maybe want to start with like what some of your favorite parts of this book are?

Julie Duffy Dillon (04:56)

It is, I agree.

Rachel (04:56)

Yeah, first of all, I want to say that that was a very difficult request to pick one or two favorite parts. I was like, this, this, this. I think Coleen said earlier, like every time she like read a part that she really liked, she was like highlighting and I was flipping through to like pick my favorite. It was hard. But I think for me, something that resonated so much is in, there’s a chapter called Release and in it Julie talks about how how relating to food often mirrors how we relate to the emotion of anger. And as someone who my whole life has struggled with experiencing anger and like really feeling it and have done a lot of work to understand and embrace like the power that anger holds as an emotion, especially as a woman, the connection of how we relate to food mirrors how we relate to anger was just this huge light bulb moment for me. Like I read it and I was like, my God, I can’t believe I never put those two pieces together. And so that was just really kind of life altering for me to like make those connections. And I wanna read one of the bullet points because I think it’s just like perfect. summation of it. Julie says, choosing not to eat because you don’t want anyone to hear you open up a noisy chip bag or the clanging of a utensil on a plate is similar to hiding your need or hiding your need to eat just like you hide your hide your normal anger. So like that idea of kind of the the shrinking around food and worried about being judged is kind of a very similar way that so many people especially female presenting people are taught that like anger is a bad emotion, we should hide it, we should dampen it down. And so that was just…

Julie Duffy Dillon (07:22)

thank you for sharing that. that means a lot. yeah, anger can be a huge block in this process, especially if we don’t have experience with it or feel bad for having it. It can feel so uncomfortable. But I think if you can sit with it, can help you move through. Yeah.

Rachel (07:29)

Yeah, and Julie in that same section talks about a bunch of different like very actionable items that you can go through to work through that connection between like blockages with food and blockages with anger, which I just think is really, really cool.

Julie Duffy Dillon (07:53)

Thank you.

Coleen (07:55)

My part, like Rachel said, is it was so hard to find, like, which one. And I did go through this entire thing and write, love this highlight heart. I doodled in mine as well. It’s in a binder because, you know, getting to have first access means it’s not printed yet bound, you know, but I kind of love it like this because I love writing in it and it is, it’s so fun. So. I actually, mine is connected to finding Julie back in 2019 because I was really struggling. That was a time when I had kind of been on my food voice journey for a little while and I felt myself slipping back into the recesses of wanting to diet and being super preoccupied with food and my thoughts of food. And in sharing that with Rachel back in 2019, she was like, have you heard of Julie Duffy Dillon? And I was like, no. And she was like, it’s this amazing podcast. She’s just really uplifting. Like, it feels like you’re sitting on her couch just having a conversation with her and like with a warm cup of tea. And I was like, wait, this sounds so good. And at that time, I was commuting in and out of the office, it was taking me about an hour, an hour and a half, which was like, perfect time to listen to Julie’s podcast. So I got really, really involved. I went back to the recesses of the podcast, like started at the first episode and like, listened to all of them and I was totally hooked and just it really helped me. And it really helped me just consider that all of those feelings that I was having were normal. And sometimes that’s honestly all it takes is to just feel like you’re being heard. Even if the person wasn’t speaking directly to you. I started thinking about writing a food letter so it really, really triggered me in the best way to to start thinking that like, like This journey is like a lifelong journey. And so my favorite part is talking about this great way to check in with yourself. They’re called check-in props or chips. And I’ll read a little excerpt now. When your brain is used to thinking about food all the time, it will keep thinking about food all the time until your body’s internal systems you will continue to have access to enough food. You also need to practice having gentle space in your brain to not think about food. While there’s no way to predict how long this will take, I have found check-in props, or CHiPs for short, help the brain practice relaxing its thoughts about food in short bursts. And as I read this section about CHiPs and what that means, you know, the steps, so if you want to know what the CHiPs are, buy the book, read the CHiPs section, but I think that you know, just realizing that there are actionable items in here that I can do when I start to kind of slip back into really thinking about like, maybe I could just pick up another diet or because guess what? I still have those thoughts y’all. and it, even though, you know, the work continues and it’s just helpful to know that there are tangible steps in here for me to take that really ground me and take me back to center me into there is a reason that we do this work and it’s so much bigger than just us. So I think that, you know, that really stuck with me because it kind of brought me full circle from the worst parts of my dieting days to now having these actionable steps and knowing that, you know, people are out there that care and Julie was one of those people. So, yeah, that’s my little piece.

Julie Duffy Dillon (11:36)

I love hearing that so much because my intention writing it, I had like two things I wanted to make sure that I was able to accomplish in this book was one, the kind of unifying experience I noticed every client having was how alone they felt. But yet there was this bizarre experience where everyone was saying the same thing, but yet felt so alone. And that feeling so isolated was part of what made it feel so shamey. I always would say to people, I mean, if you were a client of mine, I know I said this to you, like, gosh, I wish you were just like a fly on the wall with me the rest of the day so you could hear everyone else saying the same thing. So writing, I was hoping that people would take in, I’m not alone in this, like this, there’s no need to feel ashamed because this is like a unifying experience. But then the other part of it was I wanted to give a little bit of a reason why we shouldn’t diet, like why this is harmful. But we have so many books already that do such a great job of that. So I wanted it to have practical steps to help get you going away from dieting and to help you with your relationship with food. So I’m so glad that it connected in that way for the two of you. So yay.

Rachel (12:54)

And I will kind of like an overarching favorite thing I’m sneaking in another one is just I think there are so many Actionable items throughout the book like it’s it almost has that book slash workbook feel which I really You know, I have a habit of reading a Book like this. I’m like, yeah. Yeah, that’s great. I resonate with it all but it then it just kind of stays in the recesses of my mind and I really appreciate the ability to have you know, the like the chips to practice and check in or the the like journaling exercises the things you can do to help kind of connect to your anger just yeah yeah it’s just great

Julie Duffy Dillon (13:35)

Awesome. Yeah, I wanted people to go outside the book. Let’s not just stay in here. It’s nice and warm and cozy, but actually, let’s help you bring this forward and get out of the book and into your life. Yeah.

Rachel (13:40)

Yeah, exactly.

Coleen (13:51)

I want to be in every book club that chooses this book, like that, like, unpacks this book because there’s so many juicy bits. And, it’s just, I want to be a fly on the wall in those conversations because everyone’s going to take something different from this that like, you know, Rachel and I, obviously we have very personal experiences. And so many of the parts of this just felt really close to home. And I think a lot of people will feel that way and it really will resonate.

Julie Duffy Dillon (13:54)

Yeah Ooh, I love a juicy bit. I’m so glad. Well, and I also am thinking about, I thought about this a lot the last, what, four months or so, is like how this book would land with Trump versus Harris. And I really wanted it to come out with Kamala Harris as president. Alas. This is not the timeline I was choosing. But this book feels like it feels more, I have more anxiety about it coming out now, but also like, feel like even though my voice is shaking, it’s really even more important. So can we unpack how we need this conversation now more than ever? Let’s go there, because it’s frightening what’s happening.

Coleen (15:13)

Yeah. I mean, I’m happy to start and then Rachel, I’d love to hear your thoughts too. I think as I think about using my voice and my platform to talk about these hard things, anti-diet work is inherently political. And I think that it feels for me too right now scarier than ever to post my different views about why it’s so important because as we know with this administration, DEI is kind of being brushed under the rug and these important issues, anti-racism work and mean, women’s rights, you name it, it’s everything I think that this team collectively stands for, feels really hard to voice those dissenting views in all of our spaces. And it feels really exhausting and so important all in the same vein. So sometimes it seems like, okay, if I just conform and look a certain way and, know, don’t act out and don’t do these things like, yeah, it might feel easier for a second. But I personally have to ask myself, does that feel like an authentic move for me? And the answer is no. And so I think in talking about these things and, you know, Julie talks about a lot of this in the book that, you know, movement, for instance, can’t replace the removal of oppressive systems. That’s something that she mentions. And I think that it’s all tied together. So it feels more important than ever now that this book is coming out.

Julie Duffy Dillon (16:50)

Yeah, and I think something that I have been really contemplating and what makes me so afraid and like just fearful for all of us is how there’s lots of different traumas that are being dangled in front of us and then also like some that are happening in the here and now that are intensifying. I think about like mass deportations. I think about losing gender-affirming care and things that are happening that we don’t have control over, which I think for a lot of people, it’ll be easy to identify those as traumatic. But then also for even more folks, how our relationship with food is going to be harmed in that process and different degrees based on what a person is experiencing and what other traumas they’re experiencing. But when your access to food is threatened, how that is so traumatic to your body. And in the Find Your Food Voice book, I have a whole chapter on diet trauma for that reason. I think it’s important for us to name if you are not able to access food, whether it’s because of food insecurity or because you’re experiencing the threat of deportation so you can’t go to the grocery store or because you feel like you have to diet again. I know those are all different layers and intensities, but also your body doesn’t know the difference between all of those. It’ll just know, I’m not getting enough food. And so that’s so much of why I think about how this is just not an individual thing. This is something that we all need to work together to be able to change the systems and make sure we all have access to food. And yeah, we can’t do this on our own. Like we have to do this together.

Rachel (19:03)

I think, you know, if, if listeners have listened to me on the podcast before, it’s food insecurity is a huge issue for me. do a lot of work to provide, you know, free access to foods for people in the community. It’s, I think as our economic situation becomes that much more unstable as grocery prices continue to rise with tariffs as thousands and thousands of people are being fired, losing their jobs, having their income sources taken away. I think food security is going to become that much bigger of an issue and I think that coupled with the make America healthy again kind of narrative, which I have a feeling is going to even further kind of walk down the line of demonizing processed food, ultra processed food, canned food, frozen food, things like that. Anything that’s not like fresh organic farm to table. I think that folks who are experiencing food insecurity and have less money to spend on organic food, is much, much more expensive. There’s a narrative that like, well, I can’t be healthy. can’t, I’m bad quote unquote for eating canned food, processed food And that’s just not the case. Like feeding yourself is so important and however you’re able to feed yourself, like that is a healthy choice. And I think that something I really appreciate about Julie and the book in particular is the conversation around like having permission to eat period, regardless of what it is. And I know Julie in the back of the book, there’s like a food idea list with, you know, broken down by like carbohydrates, proteins, et cetera. and you and I were brainstorming for that list. And I remember having the conversations about how important it was to both of us that. You know, packaged cookies were on the list, you know, canned beans and frozen vegetables and, and all of that stuff, like boxed mac and cheese. and so, yeah, I think that having the permission to eat all foods is going to be that much more important.

Julie Duffy Dillon (21:33)

yeah, because we’ve heard what RFK is saying about foods and detoxes, clean eating, and of course, like medicine, vaccines, and whether or not those things will become, like his desires will become reality, that would be horrible. But even if it doesn’t, like he’s already impacted so much of the work that as a non-diet clinician that I’vework towards of neutralizing food choices because if we hear, if you eat more of this, you may be able to treat your measles. What? No, there’s no food or vitamin you can take that is going to cure your measles. That’s why we had the vaccine and that’s why we need it. But anyway, what I just envision in the future, which I don’t like this, I’ve how just it’s gonna be normal then to talk about how ultra processed foods are harmful or making us sick. And it already has been normalized, but I think it’s gonna be again, going back to how it sounded when I was younger in the 80s and 90s, it’s gonna go back to just really demonizing these foods. And yes, like Rachel, you were so helpful in making this food idea list. could not have done it without you because dear listener, if you don’t know, I hate cooking and Rachel loves it. So of course I was not going to be the best person to like come up with ideas. But the reason why I have this food idea list in here is because one chapter is about how to do your own nutrition experiments. I call them curious nutrition. So if you have PCOS or diabetes or just, don’t know, just notice you feel sluggish around certain foods. Like how can you intervene if at all, because it’s your choice, you don’t have to ever do that, in a way that is still like helping without harming. And so I was like, okay, we need to have some kind of list to like to go from, but I really was like, we got to be intentional with this. I want it to be including as many foods as possible. We can’t include every single one because Rachel and I don’t know every single one. And we only know like our foods. Yeah, it’s still really long, I was like, no, needs to make, we need to make sure it like is neutral. And like I have on here, like choose frozen, fresh, canned, pickled, or however you enjoy the food and have access to at the moment. No version is superior to the other. Like I wanted to make sure that they were all level. And I know that the world doesn’t do it that way, but that’s part of this process is like making enough food the priority first and foremost, and then from there adding in different experiments to see if you feel the way you want to feel, like whether it’s more energized or whatnot. So yeah, I think the conversation around like how we talk about food is going to be even more important, especially if you’ve been a voice finder for a while and you’re like, maybe like the three of us been fighting against diet culture for many years. I think even more now our voice may feel like we’re not going to have as many people chiming in, but it’s going to be even more important. Not using words like good versus bad when we talk about food. And same with talking about people. Does this bother you too? I have a feeling it does. Like when people talk about Trump, and much they can’t stand him and then they decide to also like refer to his body size.

Coleen (25:16)

Comment on his body. Yeah.

Rachel (25:18)

I’m like, he’s just a horrible person. Like, why do we need to bring in his appearance?

Julie Duffy Dillon (25:21)

Yeah, I really wish that was like something that every human being could just like, can we just honor that? Like, yeah, there are many things about Trump that I disagree with, and I can’t stand. And he’s never going to hear any of those things from me. But certainly, my neighbor is going to hear about it. And if you’re making fun of Trump and the way he appears, even if like his makeup, too, I’m like, come on, guys. Like there’s so many other things that we can talk about and who does that hurt? Like someone who’s like newly experimenting with makeup and they hear someone being made fun of because of it. Like, I don’t know, it just doesn’t feel like what I wanna encourage. And of course, same with body size,

Coleen (26:04)

So all of those, go ahead, Rachel.

Rachel (26:04)

Something like, just, one other thing I wanna kind of connect back to kind of what Coleen was talking about and this food list. Something else that I really appreciate about the food list is the intentionality to have cultural foods on the list. And I think that that kind of connects to the, it’s harder to kind of experience diversity in this new climate and there’s this pressure to conform and, and kind of villainizing certain foods and really validating that, know, salsa is a great source of a lot of vegetables. Like that counts as vegetables and injera and taro and challah bread, like all of these cultural foods and are great ways to nourish yourself.

Julie Duffy Dillon (26:57)

Yes. I think the part of the book that I feel most excited and nervous about someone reading is in chapter two, where I talk about my realization as a young dietitian that I basically was a diet culture’s line leader. Basically teaching people how to eat like a white person and going through all the different iterations of like Food Guide Pyramid to MyPlate and all the different ways that we recommend food choices, how they really have focused on the white rich, thin ideal. anything, any food choices outside of that was considered bad for many different reasons. And the reason why I’m nervous but also excited is like, I felt like I was sharing my truth, but also I have a feeling like folks like the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics is not gonna appreciate it, but whatever. mean, it’s not like I’ve been on their top 10 list or will ever be. don’t think they really care about me, but I think I could very easily be on their shit list for this, but whatever. It’s my truth. But yeah, that was another intentionality is like, I mean, I am a white person writing this book. So there’s going to be limitations in that regard, but also an intentionality to include different foods from different people from all over the world. And it’s not exhaustive, but it also is like, real, I really explicitly named like if you don’t see a food on this list, it’s not that it shouldn’t be included. Like, no, you have it.

Julie Duffy Dillon (28:34)

Please, having enough food and also connecting to the food that brings you joy and you have access to is like what Find Your Food Voice is all about. Yeah.

Coleen (28:43)

Yeah. With our last precious moments as we kind of wrap up today’s episode, I’m curious to know from all of you, each of you, and I’ll try to think of an answer to this as well, but what are some practical ways that people who are listening can continue exploring and developing their own food voice when they feel stuck or discouraged by the current climate or even uninspired?

Julie Duffy Dillon (28:47)

I have thought a lot about how right now it’s more important to stay fed. Stay nourished, make sure your brain has enough mojo because we need you alert and awake. If you have a voice and it’s safe to use it, I want you to have the energy to do that and to take care of yourself because one thing I know to be true, and this is where it gets like clinical dietitian to speak here, but one thing I know to be true is stress, trauma, chaos, those are all things that promote our stress response cortisol, inflammation. And I know diet culture loves those things and likes to say like, eating XYZ will change that. But in reality, what research has shown us is trauma, oppressive systems and not eating enough are like the three big whammies to our cortisol levels and other signs of stress in our body. so staying fed, however you can, whatever choices you have, like eating enough is going to be one of the big ways to help your body to withstand the stress of all this. And if you have enough to share that, whether it’s like doing a meal train or doing the community fridge, I know Rachel talks a lot about the podcast, or just dropping off food at the pantry or like putting a nice plate of leftovers at your neighbor’s porch. I have a neighbor who makes homemade soups all the time. And so sometimes I open my door and there’s a little like thing of soup for me. And I was like, see, that is just so fucking awesome. Like doing things like that, stay fed so you then can use your voice however you can. That’s my big recommendation.

Rachel (31:06)

I think to piggyback off of that is kind of related to this idea of food preoccupation. you know, when we have enough access consistently to food and we’re feeding ourselves, we’re not constantly preoccupied with food. know food noise is like a really, you know, hip term right now, but that, that food noise goes away when we give ourselves permission to and fully nourish ourselves And therefore, you have so much time to do other things. Make your voice be heard if it’s safe to do so. Take actions. Feed your neighbors. Build community. Call your senators. All of those things when you’re not preoccupied with food because you’re giving yourself permission to eat. So piggybacking on that one.

Julie Duffy Dillon (32:01)

Yeah. And if that feels hard, I always encourage everyone, I know you agree too, like to give yourself compassion when you’re in that spot. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Coleen (32:11)

Yeah, I think that a way that I plan to continue my own journey is just to continue uplifting those who are on theirs. So always trying to be that safe space, safe person for someone who might be questioning some of these tough things. I know someone who asks me questions all the time about, you know, the ways that they’re feeling about food and things like that. And I just always want to give them a virtual consensual hug because I just remember how hard it is in those first stages of finding your food voice to truly, it’s just exhausting. And it feels so hard and especially like Julie talked about earlier, those feelings of just being truly alone. So I want people to know that you’re not alone. And there are lots of people out there finding their food voice, rediscovering their voice, and trying to use their voice for something bigger than all of us. So I think that’s what I’ll continue to do.

Julie Duffy Dillon (33:20)

Yay, I love it. We have lots of work to do. So let’s go eat a snack. Carry on. Yeah. thank you. I’m so excited for the listener to like read it. And I can’t wait to hear what people think about it. This is such a fun chat. Thanks for like celebrating with me today. And I can’t wait to celebrate IRL, which will happen soon.

Coleen (33:30)

Here for it.

Rachel (33:30)

We do, but we have tools to help us like your food voice book.

Coleen (33:50)

Yay!

Julie Duffy Dillon (33:54)

Well, let’s sign off for now, but thanks, team.

Rachel (33:57)

Bye y’all.

Julie Duffy Dillon (33:59)

So there you have it. I hope you enjoyed this very special episode. Again, I am just so happy that you finally can get your hands on the Find Your Food Voice book. I am looking forward to hearing your feedback, what you think about it. yeah, email is always open to you, Julie at juliedillonrd.com. Let me know how you are experiencing it.

Before I sign off, I wanna leave you a little preview for next week’s episode. It is going to be a letter episode. And if you’ve never heard one before, they are my favorite. They include a listener letter from someone just like you who is a voice finder trying to mend their complicated history with food. And they spell out all their complications that they’re experiencing.

And me and sometimes I guest sift through it, offer some insight, maybe some advice. And next week’s episode specifically is from a letter writer that was included in the Find Your Food Voice book. So I’m excited to bring that to you. That is going to be next week, but until next time, know I am rooting for you and take care.